Should Mental Illnesses Be Disclosed To Employers?

yes, well this is all well and good, and I certainly see where you are coming from, but not everything is as benign (relatively speaking) as depression. What if someone has a history of psychotic episodes? And what if during their psychotic episodes their behavior becomes menacing to others?

I am all for the rights of the mentally ill. My mom works in mental health, and I have worked in roles on the fringes. But we need to be mindful that not everything is so cut and dried. The person might be medication compliant and therefore OK to hold a job. But many people stop taking medication after a period of time (for numerous reasons) and then have a relapse. It might be detrimental for that person's career to have employers that are not aware of what is going on. That person might start behaving irrationally and end up being fired AND being tagged as a bad employee, when all s/he needed was some time to get back on their meds.

It is a very complication situation, and I am not sure there is any one right answer.

"If one were to say that job applicants who are facing a broken marriage should disclose it on their resumes, one would be met with howls of laughter, notwithstanding the fact that a broken marriage can be as much disruptive to doing one's job as depression is."

So, people with broken marriages are laughed at.
Hmmm.....

Yes. 16th Century MCP men do laugh at men who have broken marriages.

This is one of the reasons, why most people with troubled marriages do not seek support.

How broken marriage can be disruptive to work?

Without a spouse hanging around the neck, a person free from abusive marriage can actually focus more and work harder. In fact, men's income grows, when their marriages break.

Sumanth, I think you have misunderstood me. I am not for a moment suggesting that it is acceptable to laugh at men (or even women) whose marriage has broken down.

Vinod, how many times your disruptive spouse calls you on work or lets say you chat with your beloved girlfriend on work. Lets then decide you the guy who is taking an interview.

These are the same people who deny jobs to women applicants if they are unmarried.

The reason you choose to do so and laugh at people is because you seek colleagues who understand your jokes. Anyways it is acceptable for you to write such things. Why are you even apologetic?

Mental illness can encompass a broad range of conditions ranging from depression to psychotic behaviour. The former might be acceptable in most cases (as long as it doesn't affect productivity much) but the latter can sometimes be dangerous to others around.

Fortunately most fall into the former category and many successful people take Xanax or Prozac, and it is not even considered taboo to admit taking them anymore.

trolls cannot read or comprehend.
DO. NOT. FEED.

forget about mental illness being accepted as just another ailment, this is one of the most neglected areas of study among the scientific community.How many mental people have you seen been fully cured ? i know of two cases where there has been absolutely no change in their condition;the docs only prescribe them meds which are nothing but sedatives.

One has to look at how disruptive is the medical condition for the productivity and working environment. Employer should have lee way in their decisions that effect the productivity, costs and working environment.

If an employee is unable to do his job, s/he can/should be fired. The reason why s/he can't do his job may be because s/he has a mental illness or because his/her marriage is breakinbg down or because s/he is incompetent. However, an employer should not be able to claim damages from an employee or ex-employee on the ground that the employee or ex-employee did not disclose details of his/her mental illness. If an employer or ex-employer can prove that the employee had been advised by a qualified doctor to not take up that job, it should be possible to claim damages. I don't think the law is settled in this area. I am only suggesting what the law ought to be.

um vinod, there is a major difference between things you can control and things you cannot.

when a marriage breaks down, you can control your reactions and how you handle it. you can choose to deal with the emotional strain or choose to take leave while you sort your business. when mental illness strikes, you cannot choose how you cope... if the illness is severe. the company, as they would with other medical conditions, owes it to you to give you time to seek treatment and work with you to keep you if you will be able to still perform your duties in a satisfactory manner.

I have a friend who is schizophrenic. his company knows about his condition. when he is treatment compliant, he is one of their best workers so they value him greatly. as a result, when he is off medication, which happens maybe once a year or so, they give him a week or two leave to sort things out and come back. who knows how long that arrangement will last, but till now it has saved the friend's dignity and moreover still allows him to provide for his family. the company loses little in return.

kela... there is no cure for many/most mental illnesses. there are only treatment plans. seems like your friends either have bad doctors or are not sticking to the treatment plan.

SS, you are right I know two friends who were/are schizophrenic. One of them was very talented, we used to call him andu for he came from andaman, he has problems with his studies mainly on drugs etc, so had to cope with failure, losing a year in college. Then he joined a small company in Bangalore, he worked hard, toiled hard. He was fired in the post recession time in 2003. He was devastated. He was shell shocked as the company treated him badly.

He was taken to a nursing home back in andaman, taken care and given treatment. He returned back in 2005, joined a small company in madivala, bangalore and he is back to back best employee in that company when i last met him in 2007.

another close friend of mine, a SC candidate, he failed.He is still a failure for he refuses to acknowledge he is a failure and refuses treatment.

Depends on how we look at people and how people look at themselves. Circumstances make men or women schizophrenic at times. But as per there is always treatment if treated in time.

SS, I agree that there is a big difference between a marriage breakdown and mental illness. The impact of the former can be controlled but the latter need not be under the employee's control. I only used this comparison because both these can impact an employee's performance.

slime... I disagree because circumstances cannot make you schizophrenic. they can make you upset or stressed. but schizophrenia is a chemical imbalance. so while I kind of understand what you mean, in the end people must understand that mental illness is a medical condition and generally has little to do with outside factors. now, if someone is already psychotic, outside factors can help or worsen a pre-existing problem, but that is different.

but look at the words you use "he refuses to acknowledge he is a failure" a failure at what? why do you call him a failure? and if he is schizophrenic and not on treatment, can you really expect him to be logical and rational? no, you must understand that people who are mentally ill often times cannot deal with reality in the same way that you cannot tell a dog repeatedly to be a cat and expect that it will happen. when they are psychotic, they believe their reality is just as real as you believe your reality is. This is the struggle and the difficulty of some mental illnesses.

vinod... OK, well I still think given your write-up, the comparison only caused confusion and not understanding :)

Well, a job is one thing. An even more vital question is - should you disclose mental illness to the person you are going to marry? The same standard is often applied - ie, Major illnesses of course should be talked about, Minor illnesses are okay, and don't need to be mentioned.

However, when marraige is concerned, most people either don't tell or may tell, but unconsciously play down their illness when telling their to-be spouse - so that schizophrenics tell their fiances that they "had a small breakdown a few years ago, but am quite okay now" ; or a person with bipolar disorder confides that he takes medicine for "an occasional spell of depression..." Someone with post-traumatic stress disorder says that she gets a few bad dreams now and then....

Its a very difficult and tricky situation. One can understand and sympathise with the patient: if they tell their to-be employer, or spouse, its quite likely they may be scared off. If they don't tell, they land themselves in the soup, later...

to not tell a prospective spouse is wildly unethical. I think that would be grounds for divorce, personally.

however, of someone told me they had a "spell" or whatever, I would ask to see the medication. but trying to pass off PTSD as a bad dream is pretty highly unlikely indeed.

Vinod

Just last few months, one of our Head Chef (we had given him partnership because he was a head chef) ran into marital problems resulting in a painful divorce. This guy, at one time, used to have drug and alcohol problems but he had become teetotaler after his love marriage. But painful divorce threw him into deep depression, and relapsed him into drinking and drugs. He also lost mental balance and started abusing and fighting everybody for no reasons. When he came to restaurant, he started picking fights with the patrons and kitchen staff. When he visited friend's house, he picked fight with their wives and abused them in foul language. One time, he peed by the dining table and asked the lady to mop it up calling her a B***h. This guy lost it completely. We had to fire him from restaurant duties and prohibit him from entering the restaurant premise even though he was a business partner. We had to make harsh decisions in the interest of business. We would have liked to remain as his friends in times of his crisis but we could not stand him abusing our spouses. There is very little we can do as his friends. He sees his life, love and family robbed from him by his wife who fell for her co-worker - he caught them red-handed(screwing in a car) from a tip from another co-worker of her. That led to their fights and divorce. They had a 2yo son whose custody he had to give up. It hit him very hard. His life turned completely upside down and he lost mental balance. He explodes in abuses and violence with anybody and everybody on hair triggers. He is now under medical treatment. Not all domestic problems result in such dramatic fall out. But it is hard to tell how far each case would degenerate.

kerty, plenty of people get cheated on and do not abuse others and piss on floors. the guy is an asshole and lacks self control. period. yes, the woman lacks moral character, but this dude is a fuck-up... no need to blame others. no child should be subjected to a man capable of that shit.

not that I would EVER cheat on my husband, but you had better believe that if I did he would NEVER stoop to that level. people like that have choices about how they behave and this dude chooses badly.

SS

I agree he is fu*ked up now. But he was not fu*ked up before his domestic nightmares. He gave up wine and women after falling in love with her. Wine and women were easily accessible to him in the restaurant, but he never touched them. At bachalor parties, he would be the odd man out not groping the strippers but rather avoiding them. He took being a chef and business partnership very seriously so he can give good life to his family. But it all that crashed on him. Losing love and family gave him the biggest jolt to trigger his mental meltdown. Would he be jerk he is now if his domestic problems had not happened? In his case, I would say firmly NO.

One would find both set of cases where domestic problems are created because the guys or gals are fu*ked up, but equally, some of them become fu*ked up because of fallout of domestic problems.

no kerty he WAS fucked up before he met this woman, and any person who hangs their happiness on another person is bound to be miserable. others are NOT responsible for creating our happiness or ruining it.

it is a massive cop out to blame someone else for our own failings, no matter how heinous the actions of the other. anything else is simple abdication of personal responsibility.

this guy was a mess and he held it at bay and then assigned personal responsibility to someone else. still fucked up. still ridiculous. still has nothing to do with mental illness.

I have a huge problem with gross invasions of privacy and the doors they open for even grosser invasions.

Suppose, a schizophrenic needs to disclose his condition, then what else?

Should a pregnant woman (not yet visually apparent) interviewing for a job be required to disclose that? Because in a few months she will be taking time off and in some cases, might decide not to come back to work, but only after her FMLA has run out? I know of at least one personal case where this happened.

Or, what if someone is diagnosed with cancer? Obviously he will need a lot of time off for treatment? He might even get depressed during the treatment and too tired to work even when back at work. Should he be fired or forced to disclose things he does not want to?

What about someone with HIV/AIDS?

What about workers who are parents and have to take time off--often at short notice--to attend to kid emergencies? Should applicants be made to disclose if they have kids, how many, and what *their* health issues are, in case that impacts productivity?

Once the door is opened for mental issues to be laid bare, it opens for everything else.

We need to understand that workplaces are microcosms of the world. They cannot be hermetically sealed little worlds where everyone is automatically protected within a magic circle. Yes, if someone has mental issues they can affect the workplace in terms of productivity, morale, and even safety. But that is life, and if someone is not performing the employer can always fire them....even if the underlying cause is mental or even physical for that matter.

jawahara, I agree. it is very difficult. I never said they should be required to tell, as you have mentioned all the reasons why disclosure can be hazardous. but not telling about mental illness can also have ramifications that are just as serious.

one needs to decide for him or herself, based on the relationship with the employer. I am not sure I would support legislature that requires disclosure, as there are far too many challenges on both sides.

Annamma - I think even minor illnesses should be disclosed to the person you are going to marry. When you say minor illnesses need not be disclosed, you are in tune with standard Indian arranged marriage practices - something that wouldnt be accepted anywhere else in the world.

Jawahara, a pregnant woman should not have to disclose that she is pregnant when interviewing for a job, but most maternity leave rules. provide for benefits only if pregnancy starts after the date of joining.

I believe HIV/AIDS patients are protected by law, but I couldn't find more details.

Vinod

Most companies in USA carry disability insurance that pays for the paid maternity leaves. So such companies would not care if pregnancy is pre-existing. I doubt enrollment in disability insurance policy is prohibited to women with pre-existing pregnancies.

But most small businesses do not carry disability insurance. And they would be wary of hiring women who are already pregnant - it poses just too many liabilities for small businesses to handle.

Thanks kerty. That would have been my response as well.

I personally know one woman who had just done a home pregnancy test (no pesky doctor visits yet) and went for an interview, got the job, and insurance, etc., took the maternity leave....and then went back to work for a month and left.

Vinod, in the US at least HIV/AIDS patients are protected by law (after many legal battles). I am glad, but I believe people with mental health issues should (and I believe are) also be protected.

The thing is companies look out for themselves, so should individuals. And sometimes companies get screwed as do individuals. That's life like I said.

I would say sure let's have people disclose their issues if employers (especially in these times) disclose their issues: financial, number of sexual harrassers on board, who's siphoning off company funds, etc. etc.

Ss, I knew that's not what you were saying :-). I was not directing my comments towards you at all.

Personally, no matter how great my relationship with an employer is, I would never disclose personal and/or mental issues. Perhaps your current boss is understanding and amazing. What happens when s/he's gone? Will the new person be as understanding and accomodating?

Jawahaara:

"Thanks kerty. That would have been my response as well.

I personally know one woman who had just done a home pregnancy test (no pesky doctor visits yet"

yes! and I know of someone, whom kerty also knows, who went in for some artificial insemination and not surprisingly her baby was full of artificial intelligence. Unlike kerty who has organic intelligence. not sure which one is better. perhaps organic?

Kerty:

"small businesses do not carry disability insurance. And they would be wary of hiring women who are already pregnant"

Yah for sure! and big business should be wary of siring the children of pregnant women. it could manufacture twins. i suppose the best policy might be to hire them when they are on the verge of getting pregnant. then they and their newborns should be forced to chow down quiznos submarines. if that does not work, promote them!!

Vinod:

"Should Mental Illnesses Be Disclosed To Employers"

depends on who the employer happens to be. if it happens to be kerty, it would be just the reverse question: "should mental illness be disclosed to employees"? it is for kerty to decide.

CS, I don't know about disclosing mental issues to employers....but are you trying to disclose something to us by your strangely random comments?

J,

I believe I should not be pressured to disclose my mental instabilities to DC right? Neither employer nor employee, so why must I?

I can blame DC for aiding and abetting my mental decline, so to speak. Or to be specific, DC has nothing to do with it, but it's a natural outcome if someone seriously locks mental horns with the likes of Kerty and Ruvy :) Perhaps I will sue them one day when I am no longer insane.